There are two ongoing inquests.
Teoh Beng Hock’s.
Gunasegaran’s.
Both having the same objective.
To get to the truth of why and how these two men died.
Practitioners of the law will tell you that the worth of a witness’s testimony turns on how much of what he or she says remains intact and uncontradicted after cross-examination and re-examination.
I have not received the transcript of the testimony in Teoh’s case.
Like most of you, I depend on the online alternative news portals for accounts of what has transpired in Teoh’s case.
In Gunasegaran’s case, I am sent the notes of proceedings taken by someone who faithfully attends court to record as best he can all that is said.
I am behind in reporting to you on Gunasegaran’s case. I shall post them as soon as I can.
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On 19th February, the Teoh inquest resumed hearing after having been adjourned to allow for a second, court-ordered, postmortem to be performed on the remains of the deceased. This arose following the earlier testimony of Thai pathologist Dr Porntip Rojanasunand that based on photographs and the first post-mortem report, she suspected that there was an 80 percent likelihood Teoh’s death was homicidal.
That second postmortem was carried out by Sungai Buloh hospital resident pathologist Dr Shahidan Md Noor.
He gave his evidence-in-chief on 19th February.
He disputed Porntip’s suggestion that there was a manual strangulation injury on the neck of the deceased.
He said that although there was a round bruise “berry” mark on the left side of the neck of the deceased, he believed it was not as a result of strangulation.
“If there was strangulation the degree of force applied by the fingers would be different and would not result in such marks. It would require a great degree of force to result in asphyxia, where there would be signs of force to the neck. The injuries to the neck is consistent as a result of falling from a high place“, he is reported to have said.
Shahidan said there was bruising at the thyroid of the deceased and a permanent blood clot at the back of the tongue near the neck. He went on to confirm that the injuries found on Teoh’s neck was caused by the fall.
Shahidan also said that the two pathologists, Dr Khairul Azman Ibrahim from Klang Hospital, and Dr Prashant Naresh Samberkar, from Universiti Malaya Medical Centre, who performed the first post mortem had done their job well.
This aspect of Shahidan’s testimony has been extracted from this Malaysiakini report.
Shahidan was cross-examined on his evidence-in-chief on 1st March.
He said that in any death-in-custody case, two procedures have to be observed:
1) examination for evidence of pressure imposed on the neck, such as signs of strangulation
2) Dissection of limbs and certain muscles would need to be carried out to ascertain whether there were beatings
He agreed that failure to perform these procedures in post-mortems in custodial death cases might suggest an attempted cover-up.
He then confirmed that the limb dissection procedure were not performed during the first post-mortem.
Asked to explain the red mark which stretched from the left to the right of Teoh’s neck and was clearly visible from a photo taken during the first post-mortem, Shahidan agreed that this was not noted in the first postmortem report, agreed that looking at the bruises on the neck was an important factor to consider in the case, and was a serious omission on the part of the two pathologists who performed the first post-mortem.
He agreed that the first postmortem might not have been done in a prudent and competent manner.
He could not explain the cause of the red bruise to the neck.
Shahidan agreed that there was a possibility that Teoh may have been choked before the fall, but said it did not cause his death.
Referring to his own postmortem report he said : “There was also a left platysma muscle contusion on the left side of the neck and also similar but smaller signs on the right. This implies there was some form of oxygen deprivation to the blood. Contusion of the platysma could be a sign of choking or strangulation“.
Shahidan agreed that Teoh could have been choked or tortured before he fell. “It was a possible scenario but not probable,” he said.
This aspect of Shahidan’s testimony has been extracted from this Malaysiakini report.
After a 9-day break, Shahidan was re-examined yesterday.
Shahidan informeed the court that the red mark on Teoh’s neck was probably there some 72 hours before Teoh fell.
Shahidan said it was not possible that Teoh was hit or strangled before he fell.
He said there was no injury to suggest that Teoh had been hit prior to his death as there were no defensive wounds.
He could not say for certain whether a choke-hold or neck-lock was applied to Teoh, but he believed Teoh to have been conscious before and during the fall.
This aspect of Shahidan’s testimony has been extracted from this Malaysiakini report.
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On 5th March, I reported about day 4 of the Gunasegaran case HERE.
The proceedings on the day saw the cross-examination of the police officer who led the raiding party that arrested Gunasegaran and 4 others.
I reproduce below the relevant part of my report of the proceedings on that day. I have highlighted in red the parts you should note.
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Rajinder said that he was in a room with other colleagues when Subari told him someone had fainted at the back at about 6.45pm.
Visva: Subari was with you in the room. He can’t be in 2 places at the same time. I am putting it to you that you are not telling the truth.
Visva then referred the witness to the Markings on a photograph indicating the position of Guna on the floor.
Viava: My witnesses have instructed that Guna screamed in pain.
Rajinder : I didn’t hear.
Visva: You said Subari heard something. What did he hear?
Rajinder : I don’t know.
The witness said he did not go near the deceased but only saw Guna from the doorway, and did not touch Guna.
He said he saw Zahir sprinkle water on Guna.
Visva: Did you or your men give any first aid.
Rajinder : No
Visva: Why?
Rajinder : (Hesitates) Because Zahir sprinkled water. Besides him, Tuan Azrul sprinkled water and shook his hands.
The witness said nobody gave first aid or called for assistance or ambulance, because suspects usually pretend to be unconscious.
Visva: That is the truth, and so he was assaulted?
Rajinder : Not true
Visva: How long did you witness this sprinkling of water?
Rajinder : About 10 minutes.
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The Gunasegaran inquest resumed on 13, 14th, 19th and 25th January, 2010 and, more recently, on 8th and 9th March, 2010.
I have not as yet reported on what transpired on those days in January. I will do that the soonest some aspects of the notes forwarded to me are clarified.
For now, let me reproduce here the unedited report I received of what transpired in court on 8th March.
It is of the testimony of Lance Corporal Zahir, who Rajinder said had sprinkled water on Gunasegaran as the latter lay on the floor of the Sentul police station.
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March 8, 2010
Day 9 of the Gunasegaran Inquest
The 9th witness, Lance Corporal Zahir took the court by surprise today when he contradicted the testimony of all his collegues on several points.
Four of his collegues had testified that when the deceased collapsed, it was Zahir (who was then taking his fingerprints) who had sprinkled water on his face and moved his hands. However, the witness denied this and went further to say he did not even touch the deceased.
Questioned by the DPP, Zahir said SM Rajinder had sprinkled water on the deceased.
The witness reaffirmed this during cross examination.
Other contradictions
- The deceased was not handcuffed en-route to the station
- There were only three persons around when Gunasegaran collapsed, and named Rajinder as one of them, omitting Insp. Azrul.
.The witness also said the arrest report only names 4 suspects and omitted Guna’s name because his was a case of drug possession.
Visva: Then why was a separate arrest report not made?
Witness: Because the urine test was not complete, the suspect could not give his urine sample.
Visva: If it was a drug possession case, the urine test was irrelevant.
The witness could not explain.
The Coroner then repeated the question.
The witness paused a while, then said he did not know.
The witness was then referred to the third report made at 8.27pm.
Visva: About an hour after the deceased was certified dead, it is stated that he possessed drugs, that he attempted to run away etc, knowing very well he will not be able to deny it. However no mention is made of his death. Isn’t this strange, or is this normal?
Witness: Don’t know.
The witness agreed with Visva that it is normal anywhere in Malaysia to make a report when there is a death.
Visva : Why is there no report in Gunasegaran’s death?
Witness: I am given to understand the hospital will make the report.
The witness denied Visva’s suggestion that he is lying in court, & that he and his collegues had conspired to conceal Guna’s death to avoid an investigation.
The witness was then referred to statements of 3 of the suspects.
He agreed the accusations are serious, but denied it is the truth.
Visva: Why would they make such a serious allegation?
Witness: Because drug addicts don’t like the police.
Visva then referred the witness to the testimony of Selvaraj, whom the witness affirmed had tested negative for drugs and was subsequently freed.
However, before Visva could proceed further, the witness blurted out that Selvaraj was “drunk with toddy”.
Visva: Is this stated anywhere in the report.
Witness: No
Visva then severely admonished the witness for making unsubstantiated statements to mislead the court.
The witness then affirmed that Rajinder had sprinkled water on Guna when he collapsed. When Visva pointed out that Rajinder and his other collegues had testified it was the witness who did it he was silent.
Visva reminded the witness he was under oath to tell the truth and that sprinkling water on an unconscious person was a noble act – there was no reason to deny it if he had actually done so.
Visva: So who is telling the truth? Who sprinkled water and attended to Guna – or nobody at all?
Witness: (long pause)
Asked if he now wants to change his testimony, he said he “feels it was Rajinder”.
The witness also affirmed he did not touch the deceased.
Visva: Rajinder said you sprinkled water and moved his hands. Now you say you did not touch him.
Witness. I am not sure.
Visva: You are a compulsive liar. There is no point in going on.
After an hour and fifteen minutes of cross examination, the credibility of the witness was in shambles.
Visva had earlier asked the Coroner to note the delayed answers and demeanor of the witness.
Monok
March 11, 2010
You can see the TBH inquest proceeding at via the AGC website
http://www.agc.gov.my/agc/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=707&lang=en
pinsysu
March 11, 2010
to get to the bottom of the truths, a change in the gomen is not an option. it is an absolute necessity. failing which we’ll have circus every other day & the only ppl laughing are those in the corridors of power.
rajraman
March 11, 2010
I swear the correct2 court will be party favor on behalf off the “GOMEN” when the judge give the verdict.
Candleman what is this – 117.120.1.155/2008 always appear as top clicks in your blog but i can’t open the side.
rajraman666.Very curious when the title above talking about swearing and the “Top Clicks” keep bothering me.
Came to ask under right know.
We can be racial but can’t be racist.
Thank u .
ktteokt
March 11, 2010
I swear to tell the truth but only that much of the truth that will do me the most good!
Vinod
March 11, 2010
Dear Haris,
Ever since Mahathir took over the realm in 1981, all this kind off shit and more shit is fed upon us so much that we are tripping over too much shit.
Personally, everything under the Malaysian sun needs to be revamped totally. However, that can never happen as long as 5m unregistered voters in Malaysia continue to enjoy dwelling in the shit they are in.
My resolution for 2010 was to get as many people to register as voter. I am already contemplating my 2011 new year resolution; boycotting all who have not registered as voter…including my %@$$#& family.
sampalee
March 11, 2010
Is there problems with justice and fairness?All there problem arise from the Ignorence of Human and is the fundamental one that all kithab wants to resolve.When one trim a tree,more branches will sprouts.It is only when we severe to roots that we put the tree to rest.
The root problem of All problem is the Ignorence of the one truth.So far we are barking up the wrong tree and led to a mnerry go round of unending frustration.
Go Get Em
March 11, 2010
“I swear to tell the whole truth if it’s convenient, half-truths when it’s necessary, and lies to save some asses”
What a cheeky title, might I add……..
at crucial times, to forget conviniently…….
Richard Loh
March 11, 2010
Najib had given his ministers the KPI, what about him, who is going to grade him.
Take this poll:
How would you grade the PM’s KPI (key performance index) during his 1 year in office.
Interrogator
March 11, 2010
Read this again “Asked to explain the red mark which stretched from the left to the right of Teoh’s neck and was clearly visible from a photo taken during the first post-mortem”
Here is a hint; Handcuff, disable a suspect from the back- hands behind, Question from the front, while the unsuspecting fellow is talking to you, your partner places a plastic bag over the head of suspect and squeezes from the back. Instant Strangulation, intimidation, Fright, Struggle, asphyxiation. Sounds familiar. Ask who were the interrogators.
Malik Imtiaz Sarwar
March 12, 2010
Haris,
it’s interesting to see how even the online portals got it wrong when they reported the proceedings of the 10th of March. It would not be appropriate for me to go into the details and nuances of the evidence led that day. However, it is beyond question that in response to the Coroner at the end of the session Dr Shahidan categorically stated that the injuries to the neck resulting in the contusions were caused by “tekanan” (meaning, I think, pressure) and that this had occurred before the fall. Dr Shahidan’s views as to the cause and effect of hypoxia and its indicators, expressed during his examination by Gobind and me, were not challenged.
Regards,
Imtiaz
Fiona
March 12, 2010
there is a difference between one’s observation and what is factual.
i.e.,
“credibility of witness in shambles..” is a perception clouded by what one’s wants to see and his level of emotion.
even with all these manipulations, absolute truth will prevail. If the witness is not credible, then, obviously, the court can dismiss him.
Barking the wrong tree it is. With the detailed proceedings, there is no way, it can go wrong. At the end of the day, it is the judge call.
all the time, we want to believe what we want to believe and that believe usually suits our purposes. In this particular piece of article, one can determine whetner it is genuine or not.
abetterpenang
March 12, 2010
Oh dear bruder Haris,
On the “I swear to tell the whole truth if it’s convenient, half-truths when it’s necessary, and lies to save some asses” bit, I got a much simpler version:
“I swear to tell the whole truth the way I see fit“.
There, simpler, cut to the chase, and much cleaner.
Don’t you agree? 🙂
Dharm
March 12, 2010
One can only hope that justice will prevail – not only in these two cases but in all the other cases that are presented before the judiciary. Somehow as a layman, it doesnt appear that justice is being served. What kind of legal system are we leaving to our children?
alwaysfair
March 12, 2010
Justice for Teoh Beng Hock!!
Justice for Teoh Beng Hock!!
Barisan Neraka!!
Barisan Neraka!!
Babicina
March 13, 2010
Justice for Teoh Beng Hock!!
May his killers never rest in peace!!
Osama
March 15, 2010
All these rascals, in the name of serving the public, being paid by the public are willing to lie and sell their own mothers for a fistful of ringgits!
They are supposed to be educated people in responsible position of the Gomen, are they not ashamed that they have been contradicting themselves in each and every hearing?
Much as I want to believe these responsible servants of the Government, but, it is clear from the onset they are not speaking the truth and had been telling white lies! Just how can these people sleep in peace? I really wonder!
Shakuntala
March 15, 2010
If testimonies of witnesses get twisted, allowed to get careless and cause misunderstanding and concern, then how is justice going to be meted out?
Will it be the truth and nothing but the truth?
Will opinion take precedence over honest judgement?
One can only hope that in the end truth will prevail.